This thread tries to explain how cheaters can steal tiers from Kaggle community. We should know the cheaters tricks to self defense ourselves. These tricks can be deduced from previously reported facts^2, ^3, ^4.
\n(I rewrote this part to make the point clearer.)
\nOnce cheaters acquires enough (false) reputation, they can easily to deceive his team mate. They can even get team merge without submitting any solutions.
\nProtecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid secondary disasters. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market to unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves is not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire Kaggle community.
", "messages": [ { "id": 2117221, "postDate": "2023-01-27T05:53:13.117Z", "content": "This thread tries to explain how cheaters can steal tiers from Kaggle community. We should know the cheaters tricks to self defense ourselves. These tricks can be deduced from previously reported facts^2, ^3, ^4.
\n(I rewrote this part to make the point clearer.)
\nOnce cheaters acquires enough (false) reputation, they can easily to deceive his team mate. They can even get team merge without submitting any solutions.
\nProtecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid secondary disasters. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market to unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves is not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire Kaggle community.
", "rawMarkdown": "This thread tries to explain how cheaters can steal tiers from Kaggle community. We should know the cheaters tricks to self defense ourselves. These tricks can be deduced from previously reported facts[^2], [^3], [^4].\n\n[^2]: https://www.kaggle.com/competitions/otto-recommender-system/discussion/381318\n[^3]: https://www.kaggle.com/competitions/otto-recommender-system/discussion/381321\n[^4]: https://www.kaggle.com/competitions/otto-recommender-system/discussion/381360\n\n### Cheating scheme\n\n(I rewrote this part to make the point clearer.)\n\n1. There is a network of cheaters, and each cheaters are hiding in multiple (innocent) teams.\n2. A cheater do nothing: they only steals their teammates solutions/submission files, and shares them to his cheater friend privately.\n3. Because a cheater can get a solution from other cheaters, they can act like the solution is made by them. So, usually the team mates don't suspect him a cheater.\n4. In some cases, a cheater get solo-medals using the solution shared by his cheater friend.\n5. Repeating above process, cheaters can get prizes, master/grandmaster titles.\n\nOnce cheaters acquires enough (false) reputation, they can easily to deceive his team mate. They can even get team merge without submitting any solutions.\n\n### Self-defense policy for teams\n\n- if your team consider to team up, check carefully the users activity history and verify if he don’t have bad reputations.\n- Don’t trust the user only because he is a master/grand master.\n- report suspicious user to kaggle staff.\n\n### Suggestion for Kaggle\n\n- force account verification. Forcing real names and verifying identification helps to prevent multi account.\n- force open sourcing solutions for all gold/silver medalists. And check if they are not copies of other teams.\n\n### Note: defensing ourselves also avoids secondary disasters\n\nProtecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid **secondary disasters**. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market to unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves is not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire Kaggle community.\n", "votes": 86 }, { "id": 2118000, "postDate": "2023-01-27T17:42:15.810Z", "content": "one basic and extremely effective approach is get on a zoom and just have a chat. Assuming no language barrier, it's fairly trivial to spot cheaters. You won't want share ideas before teaming up, but you can talk about your background and projects you've worked on prior. Treat it like a two way technical interview and talk about expectations of how code will be shared and the team will operate.
\nSharing linkedin / similar profiles should be an absolute must.
\nWe really should advocate that Kaggle puts this advice in their teaming page and assumes you've done this with folks you haven't teamed up with in the past.
\nHonestly, the whole concept of someone working on something for months and not doing this boggles my mind.
\nI put this feedback recently and was very saddened by the lack of upvotes. It could have saved some folks from grief here, I bet.
\nhttps://www.kaggle.com/discussions/product-feedback/373889
", "rawMarkdown": "one basic and extremely effective approach is get on a **zoom** and just have a chat. **Assuming no language barrier,** it's fairly trivial to spot cheaters. You won't want share ideas before teaming up, but you can talk about your background and projects you've worked on prior. Treat it like a two way technical interview and talk about expectations of how code will be shared and the team will operate.\n\nSharing linkedin / similar profiles should be an absolute must.\n\nWe really should advocate that Kaggle puts this advice in their teaming page and assumes you've done this with folks you haven't teamed up with in the past.\n\nHonestly, the whole concept of someone working on something for months and not doing this boggles my mind.\n\nI put this feedback recently and was very saddened by the lack of upvotes. It could have saved some folks from grief here, I bet.\n\nhttps://www.kaggle.com/discussions/product-feedback/373889\n\n", "votes": 11, "replies": [ { "id": 2118272, "postDate": "2023-01-27T22:14:10.730Z", "content": "I think this is simple and effective approach. Maybe cheaters will reject sharing his real profiles.
\nThere could be more sophisticated cheaters who create fake LinkedIn profile, but interviewing them can filter cheaters with poor data scientist knowledge.
i think there is account verification on linkedin?
\nor there are third party social media account verification ?
\ne.g. https://www.facebook.com/business/learn/lessons/verify-facebook-instagram-account
\n(but the problem is that you will have to be 'Notable')
What a terrible team of crooks.
", "rawMarkdown": "What a terrible team of crooks.", "votes": 7, "replies": [ { "id": 2118768, "postDate": "2023-01-28T08:58:36.353Z", "content": "True. And they even has possibility of selling their stolen solution to the black market.
\nI think discovering all the cheaters will be difficult once the solution has been out of Kaggle. So we should at least self-defense ourselves in order not to be stolen our solutions.
This is very lame practice. Those must be politicians. 💥 cheap tricks to climb the ranks rather than dedication and real hard work.
", "rawMarkdown": "This is very lame practice. Those must be politicians. 💥 cheap tricks to climb the ranks rather than dedication and real hard work.", "votes": 5, "replies": [ { "id": 2118273, "postDate": "2023-01-27T22:17:05.900Z", "content": "Yes, actually this scheme enables cheaters even not having data science skills to be masters/grand masters.
", "rawMarkdown": "Yes, actually this scheme enables cheaters even not having data science skills to be masters/grand masters.", "votes": 2 } ] }, { "id": 2119379, "postDate": "2023-01-28T18:08:46.877Z", "content": "One important note to mention: protecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid secondary disasters. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market for unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves are not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire community.
", "rawMarkdown": "One important note to mention: protecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid **secondary disasters**. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market for unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves are not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire community.\n", "votes": 1 }, { "id": 2117618, "postDate": "2023-01-27T11:47:33.083Z", "content": "Kaggle should sue them and get a lot of compensation. This would be deterrence.
\nThis kind of deterrent is effective against economic crimes.
I don’t know if U.S laws can take legal actions for users out side of U.S., but tying account and their identification may act as a social punishment if cheaters are discovered.
", "rawMarkdown": "I don’t know if U.S laws can take legal actions for users out side of U.S., but tying account and their identification may act as a social punishment if cheaters are discovered." } ] }, { "id": 2119320, "postDate": "2023-01-28T17:08:53.480Z", "content": "-5. Pay to join a high ranking team and pretend you are all part of a university class where the group only got made right before Kaggle merger deadline 😄
\nSeen this one a lot
It's really hard to force account verification. Phone numbers are cheap and disposable. Photo IDs (passport/driving license) can create other issues.
\nTwitter tried the $8/month subscription to solve this and we all saw what happened there. In reality, for some people, the monetary value of these medals is very high.
", "rawMarkdown": "It's really hard to force account verification. Phone numbers are cheap and disposable. Photo IDs (passport/driving license) can create other issues.\n\nTwitter tried the $8/month subscription to solve this and we all saw what happened there. In reality, for some people, the monetary value of these medals is very high.", "votes": 2, "replies": [ { "id": 2117581, "postDate": "2023-01-27T11:15:47.630Z", "content": "\"Here is my suggestion for defense policy of Kaggle:\"
\n\"It's really hard to force account verification
i want to add the possibility of legal actions, e.g. cheating or forging identity at registration is considered as criminal acts.
", "rawMarkdown": "\"Here is my suggestion for defense policy of Kaggle:\"\n\"It's really hard to force account verification\n\ni want to add the possibility of legal actions, e.g. cheating or forging identity at registration is considered as criminal acts. ", "votes": 1 }, { "id": 2118008, "postDate": "2023-01-27T17:51:03.090Z", "content": "@anjum48 Actually, sophisticated KYC has been largely automated and would be worthwhile for Kaggle to do for folks who want to qualify for prizes.
", "rawMarkdown": "@anjum48 Actually, sophisticated KYC has been largely automated and would be worthwhile for Kaggle to do for folks who want to qualify for prizes. \n", "votes": 2 } ] }, { "id": 2122549, "postDate": "2023-01-31T02:33:05.137Z", "content": "The \"Cheating scheme\" you mentioned is out of date … there are many easy but effective cheating methods being applied that you did not realize. It is sad cheating can get cheaters to some places on the leaderboard.
", "rawMarkdown": "The \"Cheating scheme\" you mentioned is out of date ... there are many easy but effective cheating methods being applied that you did not realize. It is sad cheating can get cheaters to some places on the leaderboard.", "replies": [ { "id": 2122557, "postDate": "2023-01-31T02:43:03.450Z", "content": "Yeah, they are classic and primitive, but still effective.
\nIn spite of simpleness, I believe this scheme is not fully notified by Kaggle community since multiple teams reports that they are teamed up with suspicious persons. So I wrote this topic.
\nI hope this discussion will gain public awareness to avoid further cheating activities.
@tatamikenn Thanks for the heads up! Man, Kaggle is very prestigious, and I hope they will be strict with cheaters, like banning them for life. Similar to how USACO (USA Computing Olympiad) is implemented now.
", "rawMarkdown": "@tatamikenn Thanks for the heads up! Man, Kaggle is very prestigious, and I hope they will be strict with cheaters, like banning them for life. Similar to how USACO (USA Computing Olympiad) is implemented now.", "replies": [ { "id": 2121090, "postDate": "2023-01-30T03:56:20.440Z", "content": "\n\nlike banning them for life
\n
Yeah, I also hope this for repeatedly cheated or severely misconducted persons.
", "rawMarkdown": "> like banning them for life\n\nYeah, I also hope this for repeatedly cheated or severely misconducted persons.", "votes": 1 } ] }, { "id": 2119886, "postDate": "2023-01-29T07:21:09.110Z", "content": "Thank you for providing this information. It'll really come in handy.
", "rawMarkdown": "Thank you for providing this information. It'll really come in handy.", "replies": [ { "id": 2121091, "postDate": "2023-01-30T03:59:03.473Z", "content": "That’s good.
", "rawMarkdown": "That’s good. " } ] }, { "id": 2119468, "postDate": "2023-01-28T19:35:37.657Z", "content": "This is very useful for us. We will stay safe from these bad apples around Kaggle!
", "rawMarkdown": "This is very useful for us. We will stay safe from these bad apples around Kaggle!", "replies": [ { "id": 2119591, "postDate": "2023-01-28T23:26:48.280Z", "content": "Good. Please share this to your teammate.
", "rawMarkdown": "Good. Please share this to your teammate.", "votes": 1 } ] }, { "id": 2119428, "postDate": "2023-01-28T19:00:43.857Z", "content": "@maggiemd @inversion Hi. I have a suggestion. Is it possible to alert the message about cheaters in every team merge mega threads? I don't think all Kagglers aware of the risks of merging teams with cheaters. I believe awareness of cheaters as a community definitely reduces cheating activities. Thanks in advance.
\nExample message:
\nhttps://www.kaggle.com/competitions/learning-equality-curriculum-recommendations/discussion/372355
one basic and extremely effective approach is get on a zoom and just have a chat. Assuming no language barrier, it's fairly trivial to spot cheaters. You won't want share ideas before teaming up, but you can talk about your background and projects you've worked on prior. Treat it like a two way technical interview and talk about expectations of how code will be shared and the team will operate.
\nSharing linkedin / similar profiles should be an absolute must.
\nWe really should advocate that Kaggle puts this advice in their teaming page and assumes you've done this with folks you haven't teamed up with in the past.
\nHonestly, the whole concept of someone working on something for months and not doing this boggles my mind.
\nI put this feedback recently and was very saddened by the lack of upvotes. It could have saved some folks from grief here, I bet.
\nhttps://www.kaggle.com/discussions/product-feedback/373889
", "votes": 11, "replies": [ { "id": 2118272, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-27T22:14:10.730000", "content": "I think this is simple and effective approach. Maybe cheaters will reject sharing his real profiles.
\nThere could be more sophisticated cheaters who create fake LinkedIn profile, but interviewing them can filter cheaters with poor data scientist knowledge.
i think there is account verification on linkedin?
\nor there are third party social media account verification ?
\ne.g. https://www.facebook.com/business/learn/lessons/verify-facebook-instagram-account
\n(but the problem is that you will have to be 'Notable')
What a terrible team of crooks.
", "votes": 7, "replies": [ { "id": 2118768, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T08:58:36.353000", "content": "True. And they even has possibility of selling their stolen solution to the black market.
\nI think discovering all the cheaters will be difficult once the solution has been out of Kaggle. So we should at least self-defense ourselves in order not to be stolen our solutions.
This is very lame practice. Those must be politicians. 💥 cheap tricks to climb the ranks rather than dedication and real hard work.
", "votes": 5, "replies": [ { "id": 2118273, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-27T22:17:05.900000", "content": "Yes, actually this scheme enables cheaters even not having data science skills to be masters/grand masters.
", "votes": 2, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2119379, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T18:08:46.877000", "content": "One important note to mention: protecting our solution from cheaters is also important to avoid secondary disasters. Once cheaters acquired solutions/submissions, they can exploit it for another cheating activities: using it for a lure for another team merge, or, even selling it in black market for unspecified number of people. So defending ourselves are not the issue for the teams themselves, but also for the entire community.
", "votes": 1, "replies": [] }, { "id": 2117618, "author_name": "ONODERA", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-27T11:47:33.083000", "content": "Kaggle should sue them and get a lot of compensation. This would be deterrence.
\nThis kind of deterrent is effective against economic crimes.
I don’t know if U.S laws can take legal actions for users out side of U.S., but tying account and their identification may act as a social punishment if cheaters are discovered.
", "votes": 0, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2119320, "author_name": "JM", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T17:08:53.480000", "content": "-5. Pay to join a high ranking team and pretend you are all part of a university class where the group only got made right before Kaggle merger deadline 😄
\nSeen this one a lot
It's really hard to force account verification. Phone numbers are cheap and disposable. Photo IDs (passport/driving license) can create other issues.
\nTwitter tried the $8/month subscription to solve this and we all saw what happened there. In reality, for some people, the monetary value of these medals is very high.
", "votes": 2, "replies": [ { "id": 2117581, "author_name": "hengck23", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-27T11:15:47.630000", "content": "\"Here is my suggestion for defense policy of Kaggle:\"
\n\"It's really hard to force account verification
i want to add the possibility of legal actions, e.g. cheating or forging identity at registration is considered as criminal acts.
", "votes": 1, "replies": [] }, { "id": 2118008, "author_name": "@kaggleqrdl", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-27T17:51:03.090000", "content": "@anjum48 Actually, sophisticated KYC has been largely automated and would be worthwhile for Kaggle to do for folks who want to qualify for prizes.
", "votes": 2, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2122549, "author_name": "yuanzhe zhou", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-31T02:33:05.137000", "content": "The \"Cheating scheme\" you mentioned is out of date … there are many easy but effective cheating methods being applied that you did not realize. It is sad cheating can get cheaters to some places on the leaderboard.
", "votes": 0, "replies": [ { "id": 2122557, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-31T02:43:03.450000", "content": "Yeah, they are classic and primitive, but still effective.
\nIn spite of simpleness, I believe this scheme is not fully notified by Kaggle community since multiple teams reports that they are teamed up with suspicious persons. So I wrote this topic.
\nI hope this discussion will gain public awareness to avoid further cheating activities.
@tatamikenn Thanks for the heads up! Man, Kaggle is very prestigious, and I hope they will be strict with cheaters, like banning them for life. Similar to how USACO (USA Computing Olympiad) is implemented now.
", "votes": 0, "replies": [ { "id": 2121090, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-30T03:56:20.440000", "content": "\n\nlike banning them for life
\n
Yeah, I also hope this for repeatedly cheated or severely misconducted persons.
", "votes": 1, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2119886, "author_name": "Yash Raj Singh", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-29T07:21:09.110000", "content": "Thank you for providing this information. It'll really come in handy.
", "votes": 0, "replies": [ { "id": 2121091, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-30T03:59:03.473000", "content": "That’s good.
", "votes": 0, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2119468, "author_name": "Dino Wun", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T19:35:37.657000", "content": "This is very useful for us. We will stay safe from these bad apples around Kaggle!
", "votes": 0, "replies": [ { "id": 2119591, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T23:26:48.280000", "content": "Good. Please share this to your teammate.
", "votes": 1, "replies": [] } ] }, { "id": 2119428, "author_name": "Bilzard", "author_url": "", "post_date": "2023-01-28T19:00:43.857000", "content": "@maggiemd @inversion Hi. I have a suggestion. Is it possible to alert the message about cheaters in every team merge mega threads? I don't think all Kagglers aware of the risks of merging teams with cheaters. I believe awareness of cheaters as a community definitely reduces cheating activities. Thanks in advance.
\nExample message:
\nhttps://www.kaggle.com/competitions/learning-equality-curriculum-recommendations/discussion/372355